Las Vegas News, Sports, Business, Entertainment and Classifieds

Las Vegas Review-Journal - News

Friday
Mar 19, 2010
Mostly Sunny
Mostly Sunny 56° Weather Forecast

RECENT EDITIONS
Sat Sun Mon Tue Wed Thu Fri

sponsored by
News


Nevada loyalty oath alarms few teachers

Signatures tied to pay, state Constitution says

Like California's constitution, the Nevada Constitution requires state university system faculty pledge an oath to "protect and defend" the U.S. and state governments and constitutions "against all enemies, foreign and domestic."

"Some people do have issues with it," university system Chief Counsel Bart Patterson said.


Most Popular Stories
  1. Police seize items at Hells Angels clubhouse
  2. Rhodes rides again at Red Rock
  3. 'Phantom' made it to Final Four
  4. Student arrested for bringing gun to school
  5. Tea Party activists say candidate uninvited
  6. Wal-Mart probing racist NJ store announcement
  7. Testing scandal ensnarls Agassi principal
  8. Northern Iowa guard's 25-foot 3-pointer KOs Rebels
  9. Northern Iowa guard's 25-foot 3-pointer KOs Rebels
  10. Republicans subpoenaed in Ensign probe

  • Brazen Conn. warehouse heist nets $75M in pills



  • But he added that the few complaints he has heard of have been from part-time faculty, and that those complaints have been worked out with university and college human resources departments.

    Ultimately, the issue is dealt with by the state attorney general's office, Patterson said.

    The origin of the oath goes back to the birth of the state during the turbulent Civil War, according to State Archivist Guy Rocha.

    "When they were swearing in officials ... in the midst of the Civil War, there were people in this country that were subversive and they wanted to make sure they were loyal," Rocha said.

    Public school teachers are also required to sign the oath. If a faculty member does not sign it, then that person doesn't receive a paycheck, according to the Nevada Constitution.

    Alan Lichtenstein, general counsel for the American Civil Liberties Union of Nevada, said his office has received complaints, but none has reached a courtroom.

    He said he thought those who have complained have legitimate issues with the oath, specifically about having to protect and defend the government.

    "It's one thing to pledge to protect and defend the Constitution and those principles," Lichtenstein said. "But the other thing is the question of defending the government, because governments change, and the idea of protesting the government is constitutionally protected."

    He suspected that more people don't take issue with the form because they don't pay much attention to it.

    "It's like the pledge of allegiance," he said. "Is anyone really pledging allegiance, or are they going through the motions?"

    Former University of Nevada, Las Vegas Faculty Senate Chairman Bryan Spangelo said he has never heard any faculty complain about the oath, and that it hasn't affected academic freedom at the campus.

    If anything, he wondered about the reasoning behind it.

    "That's my question: Why are we doing it? What's the point of it?"

    Contact reporter Lawrence Mower at lmower@reviewjournal.com or 702-383-0440.

    Newsvine Digg Fark Technorati reddit StumbleUpon del.icio.us Slashdot Propeller Mixx Furl Twitter MySpace Facebook Google Bookmarks Yahoo! Bookmarks Windows Live Favorites Ask MyStuff myAOL Favorites

    Leave Your Comment 10 Reader Comments
    Terms & Conditions
    The following comments are provided by readers and are the sole responsiblity of the authors. The reviewjournal.com does not review comments before publication nor guarantee their accuracy. By publishing a comment here you agree to abide by the comment policy. If you see a comment that violates the policy, please notify the web editor.

    Some comments may not display immediately due to an automatic filter. These comments will be reviewed within 48 hours. Please do not submit a comment more than once.
    Current Word Count:

    Note: Comments made by reporters and editors of the Las Vegas Review-Journal are presented with a yellow background.

    Report abuse

    Mark wrote on May 09, 2008 10:19 PM: Joe wrote:
    >government gives it's citizens their rights.

    With all due respect, not according to the Declaration of Independence: "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are ENDOWED BY THEIR CREATOR WITH CERTAIN UNALIENABLE RIGHTS, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. THAT TO SECURE THESE RIGHTS, GOVERNMENTS ARE INSTITUTED among Men, deriving their just Powers from the consent of the governed..."

    Rights are what allow people to form governments to protect those rights.


    Report abuse

    fluffy wrote on May 09, 2008 04:04 PM: Well, I'm glad we're not in Myanmar as well, but "defending the government that 'gives' you your rights" is one cock-eyed way of looking at things. After all, we're not perfect, and our own government has perpetrated some egregious abuses against its own citizens past, present, and (hopefully not) future. I'm not towing that line, as, according to our founding principles, we give the government its rights to conduct its operations, not the other way around. When we fail to realize this, or blissfully ignore this, we end up with weak currency, ineffective bureaucracies, open-ended police actions overseas, failed immigration policies/enforcement, unchecked financial mischief, crumbling infrastructures, insane energy policy, stupid children...


    Report abuse

    joe wrote on May 09, 2008 02:06 PM: No fluffy, government gives it's citizens their rights. That what makes our government so special as we enjoy more freedoms than practically every other country in the world. Without a government there is no country as it would just be chaos and anarchy.

    Try telling the thousands of cyclone victims in Myanmar to stand up and limit their government's rights and see what happens. The poor folks can't even get the U.N. international aid that's being donated because their militant government is taking all the aid for it's own use and not even allowing U.S. aid to enter.

    Free societies need government to enable the free society to exist. The rights of many are dictated by the few, but thankfully our government has it's checks and balances to ensure no one person or party can take away the rights of our citizens without due process.

    This is the government we (well, most of us) pledge to defend, and in turn our government defends it's citizens. No single citizen could defend his/herself from those who would break the law and defy the government to harm that citizen.

    No government, no military or police to protect our way of life. No government, now laws to maintain order. No government, no safe drinking water or food. No government, no electricity. No government, no education. The list goes on and on.

    I for one am very thankful to live in the U.S. and though we may have lost our way as of late, I take the time to recognize what our government has done for us and mean what I say when I pledge allegiance to it, unlike Mr. Lichtenstein who enjoys the freedoms this country provides but apparently has no loyalty to it.




    Report abuse

    fluffy wrote on May 09, 2008 01:09 PM: Well, first of all, the government doesn't give us rights. We limit governments' rights.

    Second, you SHOULD support the constitutions of the state and the USA. There's no possible reasoning for a governing body to compel support from its governed, as that's just plain dictatorial. BUT, if the state is your employer, you gotta be on board with whatever crazy confidentiality agreements/affirmations until somebody successfully proves them unconstitutional. Who do you suppose would undertake such a journey?


    Report abuse

    LOYALTY wrote on May 09, 2008 12:44 PM: WITH A NAME LIKE LICHENSTEIN. YOU OF ALL PEOPLE SHOULD SAY IT TWICE AND MEAN IT...


    Report abuse

    joe wrote on May 09, 2008 09:17 AM: Alan Lichtenstein: He said he thought those who have complained have LEGITIMATE ISSUES with the oath, specifically about having to PROTECT AND DEFEND THE GOVERNMENT. "It's like the pledge of allegiance," he said. "Is anyone really pledging allegiance, or are they going through the motions?"

    Maybe YOU go through the motions Mr. Lichtenstein when you say the pledge (if you even bother saying it), but myself and millions of the other honest, law-abiding citizens of this country MEAN it when we pledge our allegiance to this great nation. The fact you can even make the statements you and the traitors of the ACLU make is because of this great country and it's government. Of course our government is not perfect, but this is not a perfect world and we have freedoms unmatched on this earth.

    For all of you who believe Alan Lichtenstein, Gary Peck, and all the other lawyers and representatives of the ACLU are really interested in protecting our GOVERNMENTAL given rights, read the above statements again, then again, then again. Read them until you realize that the ACLU DOES NOT CARE about this great country one bit!!!!! They are typical lawyers who look to profit and benefit from those who often break the law!

    Remember those words as they defend illegal aliens and criminals. Remember those words as your tax dollars go to pay for court proceedings in which the ACLU has brought on another frivilous lawsuit to defend those criminals to put more money in the pockets of the ACLU.

    I pledge allegiance to this great country and it's government Mr. Lichtenstein, and I have family and friends who have DIED doing the same so you can make ignorant comments as you did in this article without being arrested or executed Mr. Lichtenstein!




    Report abuse

    joe wrote on May 09, 2008 09:14 AM: Alan Lichtenstein: He said he thought those who have complained have LEGITIMATE ISSUES with the oath, specifically about having to PROTECT AND DEFEND THE GOVERNMENT. "It's like the pledge of allegiance," he said. "Is anyone really pledging allegiance, or are they going through the motions?"

    Maybe YOU go through the motions Mr. Lichtenstein when you say the pledge (if you even bother saying it), but myself and millions of the other honest, law-abiding citizens of this country MEAN it when we pledge our allegiance to this great nation. The fact you can even make the statements you and the traitors of the ACLU make is because of this great country and it's government. Of course our government is not perfect, but this is not a perfect world and we have freedoms unmatched on this earth.

    For all of you who believe Alan Lichtenstein, Gary Peck, and all the other lawyers and representatives of the ACLU are really interested in protecting our GOVERNMENTAL given rights, read the above statements again, then again, then again. Read them until you realize that the ACLU DOES NOT CARE about this great country one bit!!!!! They are typical lawyers who look to profit and benefit from those who often break the law!

    Remember those words as they defend illegal aliens and criminals. Remember those words as your tax dollars go to pay for court proceedings in which the ACLU has brought on another frivilous lawsuit to defend those criminals to put more money in the pockets of the ACLU.

    I pledge allegiance to this great country and it's government Mr. Lichtenstein, and I have family and friends who have DIED doing the same so you can make an ignorant ass of yourself as you did in this article without being arrested or executed Mr. Lichtenstein!




    Report abuse

    joe wrote on May 09, 2008 09:13 AM: test


    Report abuse

    Jack wrote on May 09, 2008 08:06 AM: How interesting Alan Lichtenstein, general counsel for the American Civil Liberties Union says "It's like the pledge of allegiance," he said. "Is anyone really pledging allegiance, or are they going through the motions?"

    Thank you Alan for finally putting out on front street the way you and the American Criminal Liberties Union eally feel about patriotism. It is most instructive for us "Less Enlightened" people to see that you and your band of anti american criminal loving blackguards have no allegiance to anything but your own agenda.


    Report abuse

    Sally Brighton wrote on May 09, 2008 07:08 AM: Tell Alan Lichtenstein and the entire ALCU, communist organization that it is, to take a long walk off a short pier that extends into the ocean.