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EDITORIAL: VP debate unlikely to change minds

Biden smooth; Palin holds her own

The two major-party candidates for vice president met Thursday evening for their only one-on-one debate at Washington University in St. Louis.

Predictably, the old Senate hand, Sen. Joe Biden of Delaware -- who has actually served longer in the Senate than John McCain -- was the smoother and more polished performer, attacking the notion that the absent Republican nominee is a "maverick" who will bring change to Washington.


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  • In comparison, the younger Republican candidate, Gov. Sarah Palin of Alaska, seemed to be winging it, especially during the first half hour, in crafting her answers.

    On the other hand, Gov. Palin actually looked like she was enjoying herself, especially as the evening wore on, whereas Sen. Biden, as the evening progressed, looked more like a scowling sourpuss. The big question is whether voters were hungrier for a winner on style points, or whether they were looking for underlying truth and principle.

    Sen. Biden opened the debate by repeating presidential candidate Barack Obama's assertion that taxpayers must be "treated as investors" in the bank bailout currently bouncing around Washington, following fast on the heels of his palpably false notion that the current banking crisis was caused by "an excess of deregulation, letting Wall Street run wild." Later, he directly accused Sen. McCain of allowing "overwhelming deregulation."

    In fact, it was the Democratic attempt to impose social policy through banking regulation -- hyperactive regulators demanding make more risky loans in low-income neighborhoods -- that led directly to the current crisis. American banking has not been de-regulated.

    Gov. Palin responded, quite properly, that the GOP nominee, John McCain, "tried so hard" to push for reform of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac years ago, but that his fellow senators refused to acknowledge the danger. Gov. Palin stressed her own record of tax-cutting in Alaska, warning that the Democratic ticket will raise taxes, and identifying the Democratic class-warfare agenda as one of income "redistribution."

    Sen. Biden responded that Sen. Obama "has never voted to raise taxes" -- a patently false retort.

    Sen. Biden also insisted that when it comes to raising taxes on those who work hard and earn more, "We don't call that redistribution, we call it fairness."

    The old Democrat did a good job of promoting the familiar Democratic line. But the young Alaska governor -- though she was well briefed and avoided major gaffes -- was not quick enough on her feet to drive a stake through any of her opponent's time-worn cliches.

    For instance, Sen. Biden, in response to moderator Gwen Ifill's last question, said one thing he learned after his first five years in the Senate was not to merely examine judicial nominees on their qualifications and judicial temperament, but rather to block the appointment of any candidates whose ideology displeases him.

    Sen. Palin could have pointed out the Constitution calls for the president -- not Sen. Biden -- to appoint our federal judges, that the voters choose a president in part because they want him to have that authority. She failed to do so.

    By the time the debate rolled around to foreign policy -- surprisingly, since this was expected to be her weak suit -- Gov. Palin seemed to have found her footing, insisting that Sen. Obama's plan for Iraq is a "white flag of surrender," that his plan to sit down with the dictators of Iraq and North Korea without preconditions "goes beyond naivete," scoring unanswered points when she quoted Sen. Biden's own words back to him from last fall's Democratic nomination battle, when he said Sen Obama's vote against funds for the troops "was political and would cost lives," when Sen. Biden said Sen. Obama was "not qualified to be commander-in-chief."

    Sen. Biden replied, "That's simply not true. Obama didn't say he would sit down with (Mahmoud) Ahmadinejad."

    In fact, in Democratic primary debates last year, he did.

    Gov. Palin was strongest when she spoke from the heart, with a smile on her face, about the problems of everyday Americans, offering a ticket "that will win the war," as opposed to the "ticket that wants to raise taxes."

    It's doubtful voters learned a lot of new information from Thursday's debate. But if Americans are looking for a fresh new face, someone who can connect with "Main Street," Gov. Palin's performance -- perhaps she "lost on points" -- might help push the Republican ticket toward victory.

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    Dennis Allan wrote on October 04, 2008 08:25 PM: Sarah made a comment that most in Las Vegas should take note and wake up to: Something to the effect she said about our spending habits; buying things we cannot afford to pay for is stupid. Just because we elect stupid people into office does not mean we have to be really stupid and beg our way out of debt.
    It is time for an outsider like Sarah to go into Washington and remind us how stupid we were to put some of those idiots in there. Like how dare we continue to send Reid go there and tell us how sick of oil he is? Like how dare we allow people like Dodd and Frank oversee things while they get monies from the things they are overseeing? Barney Frank even told us Fannie Mae was a sound investment; I am lucky I didn't have any money to invest and loose. Like how dare we even to consider voting for Obama, when his finance chief Penny Sue ripped off millions from investors in her Chicago bank she allowed risky loans to those who couldn't afford paying them, and Obama also has some of those on his staff that left Fannie Mae & Freddie Mac with millions in their own pockets.

    Sarah is a far better choice for President, even over John McCain. She and her family are people that I would enjoy as neighbors, and it is about time we had a friendly neighbor in Washington D.C. I will vote for McCain only because of Sarah being on the ticket, I would not even vote if Sarah were not on the ballot (well maybe if Romney, Lieberman or Bobby governor from LA were on it). A vote for McCain is the right vote.


    Jeremy wrote on October 04, 2008 12:53 AM: Given the rigidly structured format and brief time allotted for responses, this hardly qualifies as a debate. Palin didn't have the meltdown many expected, but considering she's a VP candidate, the bar needs to be substantially higher. Her responses had little or nothing to do with the questions. Try that at your next job interview.


    Interesting wrote on October 04, 2008 12:01 AM: Biden made some factual errors, and once you place those untrue ideas in someones head, slow-people accept them unconditionally. So I don't think they were mistakes.

    Although, I won't vote for him, I actually came away from the debate liking him as a human being, and not totaly convinced he really cares how this election turns out.

    Biden, will always have a job as senator, if the election falls through, and he's campaigned for president in his career. And, I'm not convinced, after everything that's happened recently, and what's ahead, that he's all that thrilled at 4 years of hell.

    I think he's going along, to get along. I guess when you give up the ghost, it's a freeing experience.


    BP wrote on October 03, 2008 10:20 PM: Are you saying you don't know any illegal aliens who work, pay thier bills, etc? I know quite a few, and you would be suprised. Some have been here since they were babies, went through our school system, married and now have children of their own. One man even owns a business and employes about 7 people. If you believe health care is a "right", is it a right conferred by our Constitution for Americans or for anyone who has managed to get here somehow, legally or illegally.


    timinator wrote on October 03, 2008 09:33 PM: "timinator's" Wisdom, thank you for responding.

    Where did I say that producer A is the rich? Of course the middle class is the majority of producer A.

    Did I say I approve of how the income tax structure is primarily plundering the middle class while leaving the rich (whatever that is) relatively untouched? Nay.

    I am well aware that the richest families in this country shield their earnings from the progressive income tax by having their toadies in government manipulate the tax code in their favor.

    This has been the case since the 16th Amendment was created, which was sold to the naive American public as a "soak the rich" scheme, but eventually swallowed the middle class also.

    What H.L. Mencken said, and I concur, was that often our political candidates (from both major parties, BTW) get elected by promising to plunder the producers and deliver the booty to the non-producers.

    This is the basic premise of socialism, in case you've never read Marx, and my assertion that the mere mention of that "S Word" brings on accusations of "red-baiting" is quite valid, as "Brilliant Sloganeering" proved in the comment to TC at 08:28 AM today.

    BTW, I do not support McPain, nor the Republican Party (Socialist Party B in my book). They are both owned and operated by globalist RINO Neo-Cons and have been for years. I am sick of the welfare/warfare state and how it has destroyed our economy, our morality and soon our sovereignty.

    And that, sir or madam, is my wisdom...


    womenagainstpalin wrote on October 03, 2008 08:28 PM: To sound incredibly crass, all you need to do is walk into your local ER and you'll see how 40 million illegal aliens are seeing dr's on your dime right now BP.


    BP wrote on October 03, 2008 08:21 PM: John F

    What do you do with the 40 million illegal aliens? Are they entitled to see a doctor? What about the young people who can pay for health insurance, but simply choose to spend their money elsewhere. Is this another freedom, the right to choose how you spend you money, that you want to see taken from them.


    WE PAY MORE, WE HAVE WORSE HEALTH OUTCOMES wrote on October 03, 2008 07:59 PM: Uh,

    Compared to other countries, we pay more, but have worse health outcomse.

    Got that?

    We pay more, but have worse health outcomes?

    Got that?

    We pay more, but have worse health outcomes.

    What part of "we pay more, but have worse health outcomse" don't you understand?


    John F wrote on October 03, 2008 07:36 PM: Helen,

    Calm down before you have an aneurism.

    I'm not asking you to pay for my mortgage, nor am I asking you to pay for anything else of mine, even health insurance. My house is only slightly larger than yours, as is my mortgage payment. I pay for all of it myself just as you do.

    I'm merely pointing out that by paying for our health care through taxes instead of through our employer and using a medicare-style system we can insure everyone and spend less doing it. What's wrong with that? It has nothing to do with a lack of personal responsibility on my part. I'll be paying for my own medical care either way.

    BP,
    The difference between medical insurance and auto insurance is that people should have the right to see a doctor and driving is not a right.


    Helen Weils #1 Proponent of Isreal Welfare wrote on October 03, 2008 07:24 PM: Have you read Helen Weils at her prime?

    Helen Weils never tells us what "business" she claims she owns.

    But her rhetoric is Likud paranoid


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